TO 4K OR NOT TO 4K?

[47lab Guest Find all posts View Profile Close 47lab]

Any of you here upgraded to a 4K TV yet? I realize it's a "chicken or egg" situation with 4K & actual 4K content is nonexistent at moment but with Netflix announcing it will being to produce and stream all of its original series in 4K with DirecTV, Comcast, Amazon promising to follow suit, is now the time to jump on the 4K wagon? Is it worthwhile to upgrade to 4K just to watch your current media upscaled to 4K? Samsung has also announced that 4K blu ray is on the horizon & will possibly debut by the end of year with only the choice of codec holding back production.

Every major TV manufacturer has announced UHD (4K) models at this year's CES and some like the Vizio are going to be very reasonably priced (a grand for 50") with top notch specs. Might have to pick up one of these babies for the bedroom.

I realize Vizio has made some crap products in the past & were known as primarily a budget brand but seems they have really turned a corner and are producing sets that can compete with the major brands at a much lower price point. Vizio also introduced a Reference series that looks quite impressive but unfortunately, it appears to be for the well heeled only.

**edit**

Mods, please move this thread to the appropriate sub forum. Shit, just realized the "everything else" sub-forum has gone MIA? what the fuck?!

[Dom D Spoon! Find all posts View Profile Close Dom D]

4k looks a particularly desperate move pushed by hardware manufacturers. Cinemas are still pretty much entirely at 2k which is as near 1080p as makes no difference. If that cuts muster on a cinema screen why do you need 4 times that for your tv no matter how large?

As far as I'm concerned 1080p is as much resolution as is required at home. What would be nice is less compression particularly in the colour space. BluRay is still at 4:2:0 (not actually a blu ray guy so happy to be corrected). I think you would see far more improvement by focusing on colour reproduction than resolution though the space this would require would be huge. I know a feature on my hard drive at 1080p 4:4:4 is taking up about 200gb at the moment.

I don't see any distributors taking 4k seriously in the near future. Netflix may be pushing 4k but that's going to be compressed to shit. Can they even put out a 1080p at the moment that looks good? I know a few people who have invested in 4k cameras but at the moment they seem to see it as being useful primarily for panning and scanning rather than seeing 4k as an actual distribution method.

I'd just wait on it. By the time distributors actually offer 4k as an option the cost of the tvs will be a fraction of what they are now. I think there's usually very little advantage to being ahead of the curve.

[Paul L Scholar of Sleaze Find all posts View Profile Close Paul L]

I agree with everything Dom said. I think the 4k thing is a white elephant, utterly redundant in the home (unless of course you live in Buckingham Palace). I don't deny there's a difference in quality, but it's neither noticeable nor necessary in most people's home environments.

[Dom D Spoon! Find all posts View Profile Close Dom D]

One other point quick. I've heard a few people recently say that 4k is the end of it (as they did with 1080p) but 6k cameras are selling well at the moment and an 8k disc system has already been developed. This development never ends and your gear is just going to get outdated faster and faster as it continues to speed up.

6k cameras are a particularly interesting one for me. I know one guy who has one, I know many who lust after one. Don't know anyone who has a computer that can handle it.

[The Silly Swede Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close The Silly Swede]

I do not dare to think about how horrible porn will be in 4K. I mean, the pornstars look pretty worn out in regular HD as is. In fact 4K porn might do the exact opposite of what it is meant, and turn you off completely.

[Mark Tolch Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Mark Tolch]

Haha, good point Joe.

I'm happy with 1080 at this point. We've got a 55" that's a year old that still impresses me daily. As Dom said, and in conjunction with what he said, I'd like to think that there are ways that they can improve on the transfer using the current resolution.

Netflix 1080P is a step above DVD and looks fine for TV shows, but I don't see the "HD" aspect like I do with say, the Planet Earth blus. I don't see how 4K streaming is going to look good.

[Rakesh R. Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Rakesh R.]

I do not dare to think about how horrible porn will be in 4K. I mean, the pornstars look pretty worn out in regular HD as is. In fact 4K porn might do the exact opposite of what it is meant, and turn you off completely.

There are mainstream actors/actresses who h-a-t-e seeing their faces and bodies in 1080 high definition. Imagine a higher resolution. Pretty soon, all stars will demand a soft focused, airbrushed, plastic look:).

[Derek Steckler Member Find all posts View Profile Close Derek Steckler]

Considering that uncompressed 4k requires as much as 3.5 terrabytes per hour, streaming it at current data rates will require a massive amount of compression, enough so that I think it would outweigh the benefits of the increased resolution. I've shot with 4K video cameras such as Sony's PWM-F55, and the results looked phenomenal, even on a smallish monitor. As data transfer rates increase and storage costs drop I think it will eventually become a standard, but I think for the next few years it will mainly be used for acquisition and theatrical presentation. Of course there are people out there who always want the absolute best for their home theaters, and are willing to pay big bucks for it, but it looks like a niche market right now.

[Scott Intellectual Carrot Find all posts View Profile Close Scott]

I'm sure it will be standard eventually but none of this makes the stories any better.

Reminds me of dudes at my old job who would rave about their big-ass tv but they only watched the most middle of the road stuff on it. Hardly anything with any visual oomf that would necessitate all the technological dick swinging. It's like buying a fancy frame to hold the most blase image.

I guess where they're snobs of technology I'm a snob of content. Sometimes a nice worn out print adds character to movies that otherwise don't have any. Low-res is a dying art form.

I'm ramblin'.

[47lab Guest Find all posts View Profile Close 47lab]

I agree with all the above sentiments regarding compression issues with 1080p let alone 4K. Unfortunately, the limited bandwidth of the internet here in the US and its glacial speeds compared to the rest of the industrialized world will be one of the factors in the heavy compression needed to stream 4K. The US consumer is screwed by the few monopoly conglomerate ISPs who control every aspect of pricing and availability of 'true' fiber optic high speed internet.

I have friends/relatives in Asia/Europe who come to visit me here in the States & wonder what's wrong with my internet and if it's broken? Then I tell them how much I pay and they're stunned that I top out at those speeds at those prices. I don't have access to FiOS in my area, so I have to rely on TWC and they charge an arm and a leg to get 30Mb/s download while my overseas buddies routinely get 3 or 4 times that speed at a third of what I pay monthly.

Didn't mean to derail this thread talking about the poor internet service we receive here in the US but it's just one of my pet peeves. /end rant

[Paul L Scholar of Sleaze Find all posts View Profile Close Paul L]

I guess where they're snobs of technology I'm a snob of content. Sometimes a nice worn out print adds character to movies that otherwise don't have any. Low-res is a dying art form.

I'm in complete agreement, Scott.

[Scott Intellectual Carrot Find all posts View Profile Close Scott]

That's not to say some movies don't drastically improve cleaned up and spit-shined. That recent MONSTERS CLUB dvd has amazing colors that I never knew were there. But we've seemed to reached a plateau of clarity.

[Alex K. Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Alex K.]

Honestly I still don't see that much of a difference between 480P and 1080P still. So, probably not until they become extremely cheap, there's more content, and ISP's finally start upgrading their infrastructure for more content and stop the ridiculous data caps.

[Paul L Scholar of Sleaze Find all posts View Profile Close Paul L]

That's not to say some movies don't drastically improve cleaned up and spit-shined. That recent MONSTERS CLUB dvd has amazing colors that I never knew were there. But we've seemed to reached a plateau of clarity.

Of course. Then, on the other hand, as you say content is the most important thing; and I like to see a little damage on a print now and then. It reminds me I'm watching something shot on film, with a history, rather than something captured digitally. Like you say, there's an elusive 'character' to the wear and tear celluloid attracts over the years that can be lost on digital home video transfers (and I'm not just talking about overuse of DNR, etc, here, but rather the removal of print damage, etc).

[Zane C. Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Zane C.]

I JUST bought a new 58" Panasonic LED TV last week. I am NOT upgrading anytime soon. I bought a new tv because my old plasma was literally failing, and the picture tube was going. Before that, I bought a plasma because my other tv was done. Go to Hell, TV manufacturers!

I read an article that said this (4k) is essentially a way to get people to buy more tv's sooner. The average buying cycle is about every 7 years for buying a new tv for most people. With this, the article said, they're hoping to get people to upgrade sooner.

And I completely agree about content over picture quality. I'll watch a VHS rip on DVD-R of a movie if that's the only way to watch the movie and it's a good movie. Similarly, like others have said, if it's a beat up old print of something, it adds to the feel of some movies.

It's too bad people get caught up in buying a new tv every couple years.