Alternate cuts that change the movie significantly

[Robin Bougie Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Robin Bougie]

Was watching the new Blu of Jackie Chan's THE PROTECTOR tonight, the movie he made with James Glickenhaus -- who pretty clearly from the interview on the disk is NOT a Jackie Chan fan.

I was delighted to see that in the special features they include the entire HK cut that Jackie Chan wanted to better market the film in Asia. Jackie takes out all the boobs and swears, adds way more fighting, and adds a new subplot. He makes the fight scenes funnier, and less dark, cuts a bunch of stuff, and adds a bunch of stuff. It's quite a different movie.

The difference between the two versions is more comprehesnsively outlined here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Pro...281985_film%29

Anyway, I was wondering if we could talk about other movies that have alternate cuts that have surfaced that make it into a whole different film. Not just an added scene here and there, but a whole new viewing experience.

[Lalala76 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Lalala76]

Kingdom of Heaven- directors cut changes the story quite a bit and makes it more of an historical epic, and less of a blockbuster action film.
Highlander 2 - Renegade cut. Still doesn't make it great but goes a long way to making it a better film.
Blade runner- every different cut you could imagine. Maybe the final cut was the definitive cut. I dunno. Not such a fan myself.

[Ignatius Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Ignatius]

BRAZIL is kind of the poster child for insane alternate edits. It's a really great example of how the same footage can be used to create a film with an entirely different tone and feeling.

TEXAS CHAINSAW 3 is a much less drastic example, the significant changes were all made to one scene but what changes they were! In order to get the R rating they had to remove the little girl entirely from a scene in which she played a significant part. It's the bit in the kitchen with the sledgehammer rig. They had to edit it so she never appears, and it looks like Viggo Mortensen pulls the handle to the hammer contraption. Of course, the only close-up they had is of the little girl's hand but it goes by so fast you don't even question it.

ONCE UPON A TIME IN AMERICA - The US distributors not only cut it down but put the whole thing in chronological order, totally destroying the careful structure.

You could probably make an entire list of these just out of Franco films now that I think of it. EROTI-KILL, SADIST OF NOTRE DAME, etc.

There's a bunch more I can't quite think of off the top of my head. I'll do some research and come back.

[Lalala76 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Lalala76]

You could probably make an entire list of these just out of Franco films now that I think of it. EROTI-KILL, SADIST OF NOTRE DAME, etc

Other side of the Mirror/obscene mirror- Different stories and characters depending on which version.
Hot Nights of linda/brutal Nights of Linda
Virgin among the Living Dead/Christina princess of Eroticism (the zombie scenes)
Lady porno/Midnight Party (adds a subplot, mainly filler with a husband, also a little more graphic nudity)
Curse of Frankenstein/Erotic rites of Frankenstein (no nudity/ nudity, gypsy subplot)
Erotikill/female vampire/les avaleuses (bite neck, fellatio no show, fellatio h/c)
Demoniac/Exorcism/Sexorcisme (h/c scenes)/Sadist of Notre dame (probably the most significant with Sadist changing the story considerably).

any other Franco with added h/c shots

[Dom D Spoon! Find all posts View Profile Close Dom D]

The US and Italian cuts of Delirium. You wind up with two very different movies and they're both great! Actually I'd be hard pressed to picked to pick a favourite. At one time I was expert at all the differences between each version of this film but now I don't recall details. I do remember though that even apart from extra scenes there was some very clever editing to change who's holding the knife and other details. Very nicely done.

[Alex K. Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Alex K.]

Alien 3 had almost 30 minutes of footage cut out of the Theatrical cut. Consisting of more scenes with our characters, an entire sub plot on an insane inmate that sets the Alien free, The Alien is born from an Oxe, a ton of little moments are cut that give the movie depth.

Halloween 6: The Producer's Cut is another one. HUGE differences and more Donald Pleasance in the Producer's Cut over the Theatrical, entirely different twists in the plot, and different gore shots. Both versions suck in different ways though.

[Richard--W a straight arrow Find all posts View Profile Close Richard--W]

Stanley Kubrick cut THE SHINING down to under 119-minutes for the U.K. theatrical release. Brits didn't see the scenes with Anne Jackson as the doctor who examines Danny and counsels Wendy. There were other trims to the U.K. to make the pace faster. Brits didn't see the standard 142-minute version until the blu-ray came out, or unless they bought the American DVD. I keep the shorter British DVD for reference. There was a scene at the end in which Barry Nelson as the hotel manager visits Wendy in the hospital that stretched the film to 149 minutes, but Kubrick cut that almost immediately out of release prints. If I saw it, I don't remember it. I wish Warner Brothers had included it in the supplements.

[Lalala76 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Lalala76]

Troy- directors cut. Vastly improves on the theatrical cut, however the downside is you see more of Brad Pitts ass.

[Paul L Scholar of Sleaze Find all posts View Profile Close Paul L]

Stanley Kubrick cut THE SHINING down to under 119-minutes for the U.K. theatrical release. Brits didn't see the scenes with Anne Jackson as the doctor who examines Danny and counsels Wendy. There were other trims to the U.K. to make the pace faster. Brits didn't see the standard 142-minute version until the blu-ray came out, or unless they bought the American DVD. I keep the shorter British DVD for reference. There was a scene at the end in which Barry Nelson as the hotel manager visits Wendy in the hospital that stretched the film to 149 minutes, but Kubrick cut that almost immediately out of release prints. If I saw it, I don't remember it. I wish Warner Brothers had included it in the supplements.

I have a slight preference for the shorter Euro cut of THE SHINING, Richard. I think it enhances the ambiguities of the film - which are plentiful anyway. I've read in various books over the years that Kubrick actually preferred that shorter Euro cut and considered that his 'director's cut' of the picture, although always from second-hand sources so I'm not sure whether that's hearsay or not.

My first viewing of the longer US cut was when it was shown on ITV in the late-1980s(?) I've still got a recording of that broadcast somewhere.

[Paul L Scholar of Sleaze Find all posts View Profile Close Paul L]

As noted elsewhere, the Aldrich and Lancaster edits of ULZANA'S RAID are radically different: Lancaster's cut removes a character (the Native American woman with whom Macintosh lives) completely.

The US 'R' rated version of Ken Russell's THE DEVILS is a radically different film in many ways, imo.

The UK cinema version of Cammell and Roeg's PERFORMANCE took out 20 minutes of the film that changed (softened?) the narrative considerably.

HELLRAISER: BLOODLINES' workprint is a very different film to the final cut of the picture.

The 1973 cut of PAT GARRETT AND BILLY THE KID is vastly different from the preview cut that surfaced in 1989, and Seydor's recut of the film from 2005 is radically different yet again.

I never warmed to APOCALYPSE NOW REDUX. I like the additional sequences, but I think the film begins to lose focus. I much prefer the original theatrical version.

THE EXORCIST: THE VERSION YOU DIDN'T NEED TO SEE, anybody?

If I remember rightly, the 'director's cut' of Alex Proyas' DARK CITY is drastically different to the cinema version.

The re-edit of DONNIE DARKO removed all of the ambiguity that made the film so interesting when it was first released, imo, and replaced it with woolly moralising (again, imo).

I much preferred the 'Straight Up' cut of PAYBACK, which changes the second half of the movie immensely. But I also like the cold blue tones and the dark humour of the original theatrical cut.

[Richard--W a straight arrow Find all posts View Profile Close Richard--W]

So the longer cut was broadcast over there in the 1980s. I didn't know that.

Paul, does your off-air recording include Barry Nelson visiting Wendy in the hospital at the end? If so, you've really got something.

[Paul L Scholar of Sleaze Find all posts View Profile Close Paul L]

So the longer cut was broadcast over there in the 1980s. I didn't know that.

Paul, does your off-air recording include Barry Nelson visiting Wendy in the hospital at the end? If so, you've really got something.

Sadly not, Richard. It's just the US theatrical cut (146 minutes, as I recall) without the hospital coda.

I believe the longer version hasn't been distributed over here per Kubrick's wishes, but I'd like to see a release that contains both cuts of the picture (and the hospital coda, if it ever turns up).

Re: the shorter version. I think the history of Jack, his violence, his treatment of Danny and his alcoholism doesn't need to be said in the scene with the child psychiatrist. I think it's all there in the subtext of the bar scene. I also like the removal of the shot of the skeletons - which, whilst nicely framed, seems (through being witnessed by Wendy and also through being so 'in your face') to underscore that the events at the Overlook are supernatural. These are two of the big reasons why I have a slight preference for the shorter Euro cut; but every so often, I choose to revisit the film via the longer US version instead.

[Mark Tolch Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Mark Tolch]

I much preferred the 'Straight Up' cut of PAYBACK, which changes the second half of the movie immensely. But I also like the cold blue tones and the dark humour of the original theatrical cut.

PAYBACK was the one that jumped right out for me. I've got other films with alternate cuts that add a lot to the story, but don't really change it...the Straight Up Director's Cut of PAYBACK is almost a completely different film, while still retaining its POINT BLANK inspiration.

[Ignatius Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Ignatius]

Alien 3 had almost 30 minutes of footage cut out of the Theatrical cut. Consisting of more scenes with our characters, an entire sub plot on an insane inmate that sets the Alien free, The Alien is born from an Oxe, a ton of little moments are cut that give the movie depth.

Oh shit, how could I forget about ALIEN 3? A hugely compromised work whichever version you see, but the workprint cut they put out as the special edition is something I'm hugely fond of. Particularly because of all the extra Paul McGann. As a sidenote, the making of doco that Charles De Lauzirika created for the Quadrilogy DVDs is fantastic, better than the film itself, and they allowed him to put the uncut version on the Anthology Blu-Ray set with all the extra footage of people bitching about each other and the studio.

THE PARTY'S OVER is a fantastic film that was almost totally forgotten until the BFI uncovered a pre-release print a couple of years ago. The original theatrical release was totally butchered and re-worked to get a release in the first place, the pre-release version (there'll never be a director's cut) is a completely different film and one that packs a pretty significant punch.

[Gary Banks Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Gary Banks]

BLACK SABBATH-The story order is changed with the US having Drop Of Water first followed by The Telephone and Karloff's vampire story. Plus the Lesbian angle is removed in favor of a ghost story for the Telephone. Karloff also introduces each story. In the Italian version the running order is The Telephone, The vampire story then Drop Of Water. Karloff is dubbed and the music score and the ending are different.