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  • A Lars von Trier Thread

    While he may be a bit of a dick, what with his Hitler love and all, I've got to admit that after watching and really, really appreciating Melancholia last night I've had von Trier on the brain this morning. For the longest time I felt his filmography, or more specifically what I'd seen of it, was fairly useless outside of The Kingdom, which is super radtastic. Antichrist changed my mind. It affected me on a pretty heavy level the way few other films have, it was just so dark and sinister and completely terrifying to me that, alright, I started to wonder if maybe I'd written him off before giving his work a fair chance.

    Melancholia kind of reinforced that. It's a beautiful, tragic, heartbreaking film with some really amazing visuals. Dunst is fantastic in here, never in a million years would I have expect a performance like this from her and that's probably because in my brain she's just the chick from Spider-Man, which isn't really fair to her. I can't imagine why she didn't get an Oscar nomination for her work here, because she really is amazing. Everyone else is great too though, Charlotte Gainsbourg turning in just as great a performance and Sutherland also really standing out. Even the supporting players like Skarsgard and Udo Kier (really the only comic relief in the film comes from him, and it's fleeting at best) are at the top of their game.

    So I guess I've come around on him to a certain extent, or at least I've appreciated his last two movies. I haven't seen Dancer In The Dark and I know I should. I didn't like Dogville when I saw it and thought Epidemic kinda sucked. I didn't get wowed by his whole Dogma thing, I thought and still think that despite some good intentions it's kind of self righteous and pretentious but then maybe that's kind of the point and you just have to accept that aspect of his work and go with it.
    Rock! Shock! Pop!

  • #2
    Well, deep down we all like Hitler us europeans.(except those untrustworthy brits) Very few dare admit it though. So, hats off to LvT.

    As for his films, I am with Ian Janes early opinion still, as I don't really like any of them except the Riget I and II miniseries, or The Kingdom as you know them. The rest have not been all that great as far as I am concerned. And even though he tried to make a style of his own to make films with "matter" that didn't rely on style, he instead made pretentious films that relied on looking shitty as a style.
    "No presh from the Dresh!"

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    • #3
      I loved Antichrist. Great film, as is Dancer in the Dark.
      "Ah! By god's balls what licentiousness!"

      Marquis de Sade, The 120 Days of Sodom.

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      • #4
        I hated Antichrist. I really have nothing else to say about it. it didn't shock me (though it did gross me out a bit), but I hated absolutely everything about it. The cinematography, the direction, the acting, the talking foxes. Everything about it. I think that i'll stay away from his stuff.

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        • #5
          You should check out The Kingdom. It's kinda Twin Peaks-ish without being Twin Peaks-ish if that makes any sense.

          I'm with Alex though, Antichrist was really well done, talking foxes not withstanding.
          Rock! Shock! Pop!

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          • #6
            Zentropa is really trippy and very much worth checking out. I liked Breaking the Waves, The Kingdom, Dogville, Antichrist and Melancholia so I guess you could say I'm a fan. BTW if you actually watch his infamous Hitler comments he's clearly making a joke, it's just that, for obvious reasons they have little tolerance for that kind of thing in Europe.

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            • #7
              I beg to differ on Lars Von Trier being a dick because of his love for Hitler. It all comes down to Lars being Danish - and the world doesn't understand that minor detail.

              In Denmark (and the rest of Scandinavia for that matter) you can tell a joke or say something highly ironic with a straight face. If the person who tells the joke (or piece of irony) reckons that what he is saying is so retarded that the listener most likely will understand that it's a joke or piece of irony - then according to Danish joke telling regulations it is indeed all right for him to tell his retarded joke with a straight face! He doesn't have to explain because it's required of the listener that he or she reads between the lines.

              To someone who understands Lars' background it's obvious that he was indeed cracking a joke. Do I think it was a good joke or even remotely funny? No, it was a terrible joke. Not funny at all. B-U-T it was nevertheless a joke. Danish tv did an interview with him right afterwards and he was surprised people didn't get it was a joke.

              Unfortunately, Lars doesn't always realise that the world doesn't follow our superior Danish ways. The Americans didn't understand that it was a joke because they're used to being explained when a sarcastic/ironic/nasty joke is a joke. You're required to make quotation marks or even clearly state that you didn't really mean what you just said. The Danes take for granted that people put two and two together.

              And the French were pissed off because they felt he turned his back on them and sided with the Krauts. The Germans invaded France and now he is proclaiming his love for Hitler! Despite the fact we gave him several prizes. Sacrebleu, what an arsehole! (that was kinda the attitude anyway). And when the media avalanche started rolling the rest of the world just bought into it.

              He's not a Nazi, he doesn't love Hitler, and he doesn't hate women either. He *just* forgot that the rest of the world isn't Danish. Oy vey, if those damn Vikings who discovered America (hundreds of years before that Nazi Columbus) had stayed over there instead of going back home then you would all have been speaking Danish now (except for Quebec of course!!!). And we wouldn't have had these problems. But noo they simply had to go home to the icy fjords and long dark winters. Obviously bad decision making runs in the blood.
              Jack J
              Senior Member
              Last edited by Jack J; 03-20-2012, 07:27 AM.
              2019: The only blog to survive the nuclear holocaust

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              • #8
                For the record, I got that it was a joke - I thought it was obvious, it was just a shitty joke that came back to bite him on the ass and a joke that for many reasons (not the least of which was the fact that Charlotte Gainsbourg was right there with him at the time) just wasn't funny or appropriate. He put his foot in his mouth, end of story. If I felt he was actually a Nazi sympathizer I probably wouldn't bother with his stuff, but since he's just a guy with a strange sense of humor, it doesn't bug me.

                As far as the 'woman hater' aspects, the only movie I can really see as misgonist is Antichrist, where it's made pretty clear that the She character is a witch and that she's evil, etc., but at the same time, it's only a movie and it's just a story, so again, I think people overanalyze that side of his filmography. He doesn't appear to have any issues with women in real life and it's important to seperate the art from the artist so to speak.

                Oh and Jack, there are plenty of Americans (and Canadians) who can take a nasty joke - it still doesn't discount that Von trier simply said something very stupid at probably the worst possible opportunity.
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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Ian Jane View Post
                  For the record, I got that it was a joke - I thought it was obvious, it was just a shitty joke that came back to bite him on the ass and a joke that for many reasons (not the least of which was the fact that Charlotte Gainsbourg was right there with him at the time) just wasn't funny or appropriate. He put his foot in his mouth, end of story. If I felt he was actually a Nazi sympathizer I probably wouldn't bother with his stuff, but since he's just a guy with a strange sense of humor, it doesn't bug me.

                  As far as the 'woman hater' aspects, the only movie I can really see as misgonist is Antichrist, where it's made pretty clear that the She character is a witch and that she's evil, etc., but at the same time, it's only a movie and it's just a story, so again, I think people overanalyze that side of his filmography. He doesn't appear to have any issues with women in real life and it's important to seperate the art from the artist so to speak.

                  Oh and Jack, there are plenty of Americans (and Canadians) who can take a nasty joke - it still doesn't discount that Von trier simply said something very stupid at probably the worst possible opportunity.
                  Okay, you got it was a joke; fair enough, but it seems like a lot of people didn't get that and I'm just trying to explain to everyone that he was indeed joking. And about the joke not being funny at all, well it seems we agree on that. ^_^

                  Americans and Canadians can take a nasty joke? Huh?? You're shitting me!! Jesus fucking christ, I never knew. :p
                  Hahaha, Ian, of course I knew that, how could I not know (after all I come from dvdmaniacs). However, I'm not talking about you and those tons of other many North Americans who I would describe as being quite alternative to the norm and DO get it. I was talking about mainstream Joes here. I'm talking in general terms here.

                  Besides... I wasn't even talking about whether you guys (or anybody) can take a nasty joke, I was talking about the etiquette in telling a joke. And there's a clear difference here and that difference is in how much you need to explain to the listener. Lars von Trier didn't explain anything (until he realised his audience didn't get it) because he's not used to having to do that. It's simply a cultural difference.
                  2019: The only blog to survive the nuclear holocaust

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Jack J View Post
                    Besides... I wasn't even talking about whether you guys (or anybody) can take a nasty joke, I was talking about the etiquette in telling a joke. And there's a clear difference here and that difference is in how much you need to explain to the listener. Lars von Trier didn't explain anything (until he realised his audience didn't get it) because he's not used to having to do that. It's simply a cultural difference.
                    This I can understand and accept. My grandmother (Dutch) tends to be very politically incorrect sometimes without realizing she's saying things that other people in the family find offensive. I do think Europeans tend to view North America as a bit stuff though, at least that comes across sometimes (not to center you out) online. There's probably some truth to that, cultural differences as you say - but I think the average North American probably would realize he was making a joke, I don't think that really went over the mass populace's head, instead I think the issue was the fact that he made a joke about it in the first place, which is understandably taboo with certain segments.

                    I think we're on the same page, just sort of running around in circles here.

                    Has anyone have any thoughts on Melancholia? It was definitely a way more accessible film than a lot of his other ones were but still pretty out there. The first ten minutes though, wow. He doesn't really top it after that. haha. The rest of the movie is really good and I was definitely into it despite the long running time but the visuals of the beginning sequence were so strong I wonder if maybe it would have been better to end it that way than start it? On the flip side, I guess he was going against the grain and letting us know exactly where it was all heading early on so that we could concetrate more on the characters in the film than the spectacle.
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                    • #11
                      I may or may not have been ironic in my appreciation of Hitler. You guys will never know for sure.

                      On topic, I feel I will rent Melancholia next time I rent movies. I will watch it trying to descide if Southerland Jr was drunk when he shot his scenes or not.
                      "No presh from the Dresh!"

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                      • #12
                        So his next project is going to be called Nymphomaniac and it's going to be shot as a hardcore film with Charlotte Gainsbourg and Stellan Skarsgard?

                        http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/new...ars-von-315543
                        "But Nymphomaniac, which promises to trace “the erotic life of a woman from the age of zero to the age of 50," could be von Trier's most scandalous film yet. Gainsbourg is set to play Joe, a woman who tells the story of her sexual history to the older bachelor Seligman (Skarsgard).

                        Von Trier plans to shoot both a soft and hardcore version of the English-language feature, with the latter expected to include graphic depictions of penetration. German funding body the NRW Filmstifftung is backing Nymphomaniac with $1.6 million (€1.2 million) in production subsidies. The film will be shot entirely in the German state of North-Rhein Westphalia, where von Trier shot Antichrist. Production is set to begin this summer."
                        Rock! Shock! Pop!

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                        • #13
                          It will be interesting to see if Von Trier can pull this off, he's on a roll right now imo so I think he just might do it.

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                          • #14
                            I hear he's also planned a Nazi propaganda/horror film for 2013. Apparently the working title is "The Kingdom - the 3. Reich Years".

                            2019: The only blog to survive the nuclear holocaust

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Ian Jane View Post
                              Melancholia
                              It's a beautiful, tragic, heartbreaking film with some really amazing visuals. Dunst is fantastic in here, never in a million years would I have expect a performance like this from her and that's probably because in my brain she's just the chick from Spider-Man, which isn't really fair to her. I can't imagine why she didn't get an Oscar nomination for her work here, because she really is amazing. Everyone else is great too though, Charlotte Gainsbourg turning in just as great a performance and Sutherland also really standing out. Even the supporting players like Skarsgard and Udo Kier (really the only comic relief in the film comes from him, and it's fleeting at best) are at the top of their game.
                              I guess I'm a bad Dane as I hadn't seen "Melancholia" till this afternoon! :cuckoo:
                              However, I basically agree with everything Ian said! I thought the intro (frí¤ulein Dunst, falling birds, and music) was stretched a little too long but everything else was perfect. And like Ian, I still thought of Kirsten Dunst as the teen chick from Spider-man and I certainly didn't expect the nude scenes (but, uh, I'm not complaining).

                              I bought the UK dvd and the extras were limited to very little; A proper "Making of" would have been nice.
                              Jack J
                              Senior Member
                              Last edited by Jack J; 04-30-2012, 01:49 PM.
                              2019: The only blog to survive the nuclear holocaust

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